{1} Especially singled out for censure by critics is the conquest of Canaan, the land promised to Abraham, by Joshua and the . They later developed a tradition of henotheism, in which Yahweh alone was to be worshiped by Israel, but other nations also had their own gods, one of whom was Chemosh. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. //, It does NOT say "the Israelites became afraid and stopped fighting.". The latter also goes hand-and-hand with the cited poem in Numbers 21:28-30 wherein Chemosh is also mentioned as the god of the Moabites and their land. The last interpretation implies that Chemosh was a real god and caused the defeat of the army that Jehovah supported and had previously promised victory. Certainly in polytheistic religions, gods do lose battles. The goddess Astarte was probably the cult partner of Chemosh. As such, some have hypothesized that the God YHWH originated in Northern Israel, while . 21:29; Jer. Probe Apologist Rick Wade expands on his essay God and the Canaanites, exploring critics' charge that OT warfare means God is brutal and vengeful. Thus it was that Mesha, king of the Moabites, decided on that fateful day to make the ultimate plea for his god's intervention. Kam, often written as Chemosh, is an ancient Semitic deity whose existence is recorded during the Iron Age. "I am Mesha, son Chemosh[it], king of Moab, the Dibonite.". Little is known about Chemosh; although King Solomon of Israel built a sanctuary to him east of Jerusalem (1 Kings 11:7), the shrine was later demolished by King Josiah (2 Kings 23:13). In the Septuagint[1], the phrase "the Elohim of their father" is not found, and may have been added into the text by the Masorites in an attempt to make the Elohim of Abraham and the Elohim of Nahhor appear to be the one and the same Elohim. Chemosh seems to have also had a taste for blood. One says: The king sacrificed his son for the sake of Heaven, and one says: The king sacrificed his son for the sake of idol worship. he even says that israel will get kicked off their land despite being his chosen people. As a review of the discrepancies between the Moab traditions in our sources, I briefly note the following in chronological order: 1. Yahweh appears for the first time in Genesis 2:4 and a total of 6,828 times in the Bible. . Solomon erected an altar to Chemosh south of the Mount of Olives outside Jerusalem, on the Hill of Corruption. Such synthesis reveals the masculinization of Ashtoreth, a Canaanite goddess worshiped by Moabites and other Semitic peoples. Dr. Judd H. Burton is an historian and anthropologist. 5 The gods know nothing, they understand nothing. Nergal Baal Berith Anammelech Nibhaz Ninurta Dagon. They walk about in darkness; all the foundations of the earth are shaken. Yahweh would have delivered Israel anyway, without Jephthah's . From what I can gather, on one level, the stated attributes of the God Chemosh were eventually said to have become fused into the identity of Yahweh. But the opportunity passed without improvement. Facebook. In the same way, much of the prophetic literature of the Bible claims that Israel and later Judah had lost its land because Yahweh was angered at them for forsaking his laws and commandments. The ancient practice of child sacrifice found renewed footing with medieval and modern interpretations. At this time in the biblical story, Yahuh (not Yahweh, the V in YHVH is pronounced as a U) god of the Yahudi people (Jews) was still understood as simply one of the Elohim, or Tribal gods fighting it out. Mesha says that he captured Nebo, a town located on the very mountain where Moses traditionally saw the promised land before dying. The vassalage had existed since the reign of David (2 Samuel 8:2), but the Moabites revolted upon the death of Ahab. The Very First Bible: You ever hear of Kronos vs Zeus? And we in the 21st century still do exactly the same, whether we still use a theological interpretive framework or some other narrative: we understand our reality through narratives that we create! The Moabites are apostrophized in an old Hebrew song as the "people of Chemosh" ( Nu 21:29 ). God Had a Wife? Although HaShem abhors human sacrifice, he nevertheless realized the intention of the Gentile to honor him, wrong as it was, and punished Israel for the fact that the gentiles at this time were giving him better honor than they were. As noted in the footnotes of the NET bible: [2]. From this we can deduce a number of probable facts about Chemosh. That is each nationIsraelite, Babylonian, Egyptian, Moabite, etc.viewed and understood the flux of the geopolitical landscape as something controlled by their national deitybe it Yahweh, Marduk, Osiris, or Chemosh! The fury against Israel was great; they withdrew and returned to their own land." The Moabite Stone is a priceless source of information concerning Chemosh. (Ex 33:11 vs Num 1:51, 3:10, 3:38, 18:5-7), #224. Some hold that the Moabite god "Baal-peor" of Num. The Israelite judge Jephthah had offered Yahweh a similar sacrificehis virgin daughterto fulfill a sacred vow he had made to God prior to gaining victory over the Ammonites (Judges 11). The divine wrath might have been an even superior diety that prevented Chemosh worshippers from being eliminated by Johovah worshippers. Mixing of religions, worship of many gods. But which deity? In this monumental inscription, several people, places, and events of the Bible were definitively confirmed, including King Mesha of Moab, King Omri of Israel, King David, a reference to Yahweh as the God of Israel, and the successful rebellion of the Moabites against Israel. Chemosh was the national deity of the Moabites whose name most likely meant "destroyer," "subduer," or "fish god." While he is most readily associated with the Moabites, according to Judges 11:24 he seems to have been the national deity of the Ammonites as well. These facts are inexplicable except on the theory that neither Elisha nor Elijah nor the men who wrote their lives denied the existence of the heathen gods. Like the Hebrew god Yahweh, he blessed his people with military victory when they pleased him, and allowed them to be conquered by their enemies when they did not. The Mesha Stele, also known as the Moabite Stone, is a black basalt monument bearing an inscription by the ninth century B.C.E. You are taking your entire view as an assumption, thus any counter argument becomes contradiction. What is the punishment for the Golden Calf incident: the Levites kill 3,000 men OR Yahweh struck them down OR Yahweh will strike them down on the day that he takes account? In this regard my educational and literary pursuits are much much greater than any believer. It is an attempt to understand man, including our forefathers, in all his aspects. If Israel had pressed forward, they would've destroyed Moab. Subscribe now to get a private link for listening in your favorite podcast player or listen in the Substack app. Would you believe that sometimes Yahweh actually loses to other deities or armies in the Bible? That suggests it wasnt redacted until the exile period, when the Pentatuch was created, as opposed to an earlier JE redaction. While he is most readily associated with the Moabites, according to Judges 11:24 he seems to have been the national deity of the Ammonites as well. If so, Chemosh probably stood in the position of Asthar's husband, as did El to Asherah and Baal to Astarte. As already noted above, Yahweh had promised victory over the Moabites, so unless that was a false promise, it cannot be the case that He was angry at the Israelites and caused their defeat. Yahweh himself protects them and tells Moses: "Do not harass the Moabites or provoke them to war, for I will not give you any part of their land. S o begins one of the most extraordinary ancient documents ever found. Another reason that the worship of Baal and Asherah was a perennial problem for Israel is due to what we could call national peer pressure. Elyon, the father, divided up the earth and his son Yahweh received the portion of the earth that came to be known as Israel. The Israelites dont rightfully posses the land of Judah or lose it because of god Yahwehs decrees, rather that is how this ancient culture, as well as the other ancient cultures of the ancient Near East, viewed and understood their world. https://www.blockonomics.co/pay-url/d67c8d28371411eb. We saw in previous entries (Contradictions #364-369) that the author of Deuteronomy took liberties in having his Moses renarrate the Edom event, now presenting the Edomites as amicable toward their Israelite brethren and allowing them to pass through their territory and to procure food and drink. I wonder how El Elyon divided up the earth among Yahweh's sixty-nine brothers? 3 Defend the weak and the fatherless; uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed. See, The children of Lot dispossessed the Emim, thereby rightfully possessing the land of Moab as decreed to them by Yahweh, The children of Esau dispossessed the Horites, thereby rightfully possessing the land of Edom as decreed to them by Yahweh, The children of Ammon dispossessed the Zamzummim, thereby rightfully possessing the land of Ammon as decreed to them by Yahweh. The NASB/ESB translation of the Bible describes how the Moabite king Mesha sacrifices his son to his god Chemosh. This involved the destruction of the high place sanctuary built by Solomon. Genesis 1:1-2 Not a Creation ex nihilo! This article abides by terms of the Creative Commons CC-by-sa 3.0 License (CC-by-sa), which may be used and disseminated with proper attribution. Then all the people said, "What you say is good.". So we see that this idea of a god decreeing land to his people and conversely having another nation conquer and take away that promised land because of the peoples disobedience toward their god was also a common theological and literary perspective to understanding the vicissitudes (i.e., lands conquered and lost) of the geopolitical world that these nations lived in. in anthropology and a Ph.D. in history from Texas Tech University. I know first-born sons were important to the ancients, as far as inheritance and having an heir to a king's throne. This does not seem likely since Jehovah had promised Israel would prevail over the Moabites and it is not suggested in the text. The Bible also states in Numbers 21:29-30; that Dibon was a city in the land of Moab and mentions their god, Chemosh. "My god helps me win and defeat your god" -> Chemosh vs. Yahweh Temple of Solomon Yahwism Worship of Yahweh by the people of Israel. For my part, my unique educational trajectory through various disciplines of the HumanitiesPh.D. Podcast Pre-Nicene PerspectiveYahweh vs. Chemosh: Battle of the Hebrew War Gods in II Kings 3:262023217 Chemosh may also be seen as a "ba'al," or as the Moabite equivalent of the Canaanite Ba'al. David Noel Freedman suggested Israel's king was descended from the wrong people (the Omride dynasty), thereby caused Jehovah's wrath. The Moabites are apostrophized in an old Hebrew song as the "people of Chemosh" (Nu 21:29). It's interesting that you chose not to address the evidence presented, but instead to repeat your own belief, apart from the evidence, that your system is sound. First, he was Moab's national god. The ultimate journey is to understand ourselves. Begin! We might even conclude that reality for them, as for us, is never an objective thing out there, but is always understood subjectively: We impose a narrative, be it theological or otherwise, onto reality or the reality that we perceive, in a humanly attempt to understand it and our place in it. The incorrect understanding is the backwards assumption of omnipotence from later Persian influence. Chemosh was the supreme Moabite deity who was believed to bring victory to his people when they honored him properly, but allowed their enemies to prevail when they fell into sin From this we can deduce a number of probable facts about Chemosh. Copy link. It's predictive power is a bit suspect but it's never really wrong! The specific characteristics of Chemosh are not clear in many respects. Apparently you didn't read the whole chapter and are deliberately taking it out of context in order to preach your unsupported claims. Note that the Hebrew states, "they will judge," not "he will judge," therefore we are looking at two different Elohim, one belonging to Abraham (the ancestor of Jacob) and the other to Nahhor (the ancestor of Laban). The fallen angel Belphegor was often connected to this deity. Which god is the creator of the heavens and the earth: Yahweh OR El? Chemosh, the subduer, was the national god of the Moabites and was also worshiped by the Ammonites. In 1868, an archaeological find at Dibon provided scholars with more clues to the nature of Chemosh. You have perished, O people of Chemosh!" Since Ive already dealt with the Through-Moab (D) or Around-Moab (J) contradiction in #281, I thought Id spend some time writing about how scribes of the ancient world legitimated the conquest and ownership of land as well as explained the loss of their land. This rules out Jehovah's omnipotence. The high place on which Mesha oriented the stone was dedicated to Chemosh as well. Angels are Elohim. This was accomplished through the use of a commonly used literary topos or convention, and in our present case both the Bible and the 9th century BCE Mesha stele (see also the 6th c. Babylonian cylinder seal) bear witness to this literary convention. [4]. This site requires JavaScript to run correctly. compare all religions to the jewish religion. Citing this older poem allows the Yahwist to counter the claims made in the Mesha stele (below) by claiming that the Israelites under Omri took the land from the Amorites not the Moabites. Yahweh vs. Chemosh: Battle of the Hebrew War Gods in II Kings 3:26. firstbiblenetwork.substack.com. This is fitting, considering that God . Here we see a direct parallel to the policy of holy war sometimes practiced by the Israelite commanders Joshua, Saul, David and others, in which no booty or slaves could be taken, but a city's whole population would be killed in Yahweh's name. Jehovah have previously promised that Israel would prevail. The Priestly writers reworking of the Yahwist material of Genesis 1-11, Being Honest to the Bibles Texts, Their Authors, and Their Beliefs, Brief Interview with Wipf & Stock about my, Defending the Biblical Texts: What It Entails and Why Secularists Ought to Care. Support the show with bitcoin: fbn@getalby.com Additionally, both Judges 11:24 and the Heshbon poem of Num 21:28-30 also acknowledge Chemosh as god of the land of Moab. [3] Apologetics This does not reflect the most likely translation "divine anger", which never refers to armies. endeavors of King Mesha to overthrow the Israelite dominion of Moab. Chemosh (from Hebrew , pronounced /emo/), was the primary god of the Moabites (Num. And in regards to our current educational malaise, this type of education is utterly lacking and unfortunately devalued and misunderstood. Do you think it is inconceivable that a follower of Yahweh could acknowledge the existence of another god? 4 Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver them from the hand of the wicked. your conclusion does not follow. [6]. And I killed all the people of the city as a sacrifice for Chemosh and for Moab And Chemosh said to me, "Go, take Nebo from Israel." It is entirely within his abilities. Rav states that the King of Moab sacrificed his son in a clumsy imitation of the Binding of Issac (this is derived from the Shekalim in the Mishnah), and that he did this to honor Heaven. The Gemara asks: Granted, according to the one who says that he sacrificed him for the sake of Heaven, this is as it is written: And there was great indignation against Israel, as the gentile attempted to honor God according to his understanding, while the Jewish people were straying from worshipping God, leading to Gods anger against them. Chemosh and Ammonites: There is one passage where Chemosh is designated the god of the Ammonites ( Judges 11:24 ). But grace is doing less than you are capable in the name of mercy and love. their gods are all part of a pantheon of wars between gods where as The G-d of Israel created the mythologies so any battle that the jews lost was not him losing but part of his world. (Num 21:29; Judg 11:24 & the Mesha stele vs Deut 2:24), #371. (Ex 21:12-24 vs Matt 5:39). " Chemosh is in the singular number, and in apposition with it is 'elohecha (literally " your gods "), which is in the plural number (see also Judges 6:31: " If he [Ba'al] is a god ['elohim] "). But I looked down on him and on his house. Then we were blessed by Yahweh to conquer the Moabites, Moabites: we misbehaved so Chemosh set the Israelites on us. After passing through Edom, did Yahweh speak to Moses about the dispossession of Moab, Edom, and Ammon OR not? 48:7, 13, 46). Also known as the "Mesha Stele," this remarkable monument was erected about 850 B.C.E. [5] The great divine wrath might have therefore been satanic. So Jacob swore by the Fear of his father Isaac, (Genesis 31:53, RSV). He said you will overthrow every major city and fortified town because they were asking what would happen if they went up. Your first introduction. The 8th 9th century Yahwist Tradition (Num 21:15-31), 2. Yahweh vs. Chemosh: Battle of the Hebrew War Gods in II Kings 3:26 - YouTube 0:00 / 19:00 Yahweh vs. Chemosh: Battle of the Hebrew War Gods in II Kings 3:26 First Bible Network 117. The Lord has called these three kings to give them into the hand of Moab."'). We know that Yahweh's brother, Chemosh, got the region of the Moabites. (Judges 11). http://triangulations.wordpress.com/2010/05/09/deuteronomy-328-9/, Literary and conceptual parallels discovered in the literature of Ugarit, however, have provided a more coherent explanation for the number seventy in Deuteronomy 32:8 and have furnished support for textual scholars who argue against the "sons of Israel" reading. This practice, while gruesome, was certainly not unique to the Moabites, as such rites were commonplace in the various Canaanite religious cults, including those of the Baals and Moloch. Please, How would the Pre-Nicene Christians view the tumultuous events of today? He also names Mesha as the son of Chemosh. But the name Yahweh occurs 196 times in the Bible before Exodus 6:3. Do the Israelites set out for the wilderness of Paran OR Hazeroth? Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, atheist w.r.t the Christian God | agnostic w.r.t others. (Num 21:10 vs Num 33:41), #166. But as a common literary topos, this same appeal to divine decree and the possession of land was also legitimated through the scribal pen of other ancient Near Eastern cultures, such as the Moabites, where it was Chemoshnot Yahwehwho decreed Moabs land as a rightful possession to the Moabites! 6. Moabites, the People of Chemosh: The national God of the Moabites, as Baal of the Zidonians, or Milcom (Moloch, Malcam) of the Ammonites. New World Encyclopedia writers and editors rewrote and completed the Wikipedia article So Israel is made up of humans, and Elijah's prophecy is not a prophecy of predestined destruction of Moab. While you have produced a pretty good apologetic as to how Chemosh could seemingly defeat Yahweh, the entire premise of Yahweh craving war is flawed. He was called by the ancient Israelites as "the abomination of Moab". Burton, Judd H. (2021, November 12). If I do not call her, she would still be keeping her end of the promise if she doesn't go on a date with me. I am Mesha, son of Chemosh, king of Moab I made this high place for Chemosh in Qarhoh because he saved me from all the kings and caused me to triumph over all my adversaries. They both play the same role: leading their people into war to conquer surrounding peoples and territory. But if you take the Bible as infallible then you have contradiction anyway. Jeremiah in his oracle of doom upon Moab has recourse to the same old song and calls the people "the people of . (Lev 7:20-21 vs Deut 12:20-22), #143. Do the Israelites leave Egypt on the 15th day of the 1st month, #162. "Deconstructing the past to make sense of today." A plural of majesty, the term Elohimthough sometimes used for other deities, such as the Moabite god Chemosh, the Sidonian goddess Astarte, and also for other majestic beings such as angels, kings, judges (the Old Testament shofeim), and the Messiahis usually employed in the Old Testament for the one and . Credit is due under the terms of this license that can reference both the New World Encyclopedia contributors and the selfless volunteer contributors of the Wikimedia Foundation. Adonis | Anat | Asherah | Ashima | Astarte | Atargatis | Scholars contend that both the 7th century Deuteronomist and the 6th century Priestly writer reworked in different fashion the earlier Yahwist-Elohist tradition. Calvinism may have a hard time with this because they remove any element of human free-will, but I do not, because God kept his promise and let his people not accept it. King Solomon dedicated an altar to Chemosh outside of Jerusalem in honor of his Moabite wife. Qetesh | At times, human sacrifice was dedicated to Chemosh, as it was to Molech and occasionally to Yahweh as well. First, he was Moab's national god. Mesha made it clear that he understood Chemosh's anger and the reason he allowed the Moabites to fall under the rule of Israel. Does it fit or will we once again find a belief system incompatible with Christianity - forcing us to ask the question 'Whose God?' Notes: The Very First Bible: https://www . He is one of many gods, and he is a god that can be beaten. Just as the worship of Yahweh set Israelites apart from other peoples during the Iron Age II, so did the Ammonites' worship of Milcom distinguish them from their closest neighbors and rivals. The biblical hero, Jephthah, gave Chemosh equal billing with Yahweh. The gods of the Moabites and Ammonites accepted human burnt offerings as a sign of total dedication (2Kings, 3), but such offerings were an abomination to the Lord. Hadad | Kothar | Melqart | Mot | Moloch | we can see this in the story of Elijah vs the Baal worshipers, 1 Kings 18:24 Then you call on the name of your gods (Eloheychem), and I will call on the name of the LORD (YHVH). Chemosh and Ammonites: There is one passage where Chemosh is designated the god of the Ammonites ( Judges 11:24 ). Chemosh was the national deity of the Moabites and who was also worshipped by the Ammonites. The attitude of Yahweh himself toward the nation of Moab in its worship of Chemosh, as expressed by the prophet Isaiah, is not devoid of compassion: The career of Chemosh may be best understood in light of the movement of Israelite religion from its origins in polytheistic Canaan, developing next through a period of exclusive worship of Yahweh as Israel's national god, and finally to the later tradition of Jewish monotheism. Kam was the supreme deity of the Canaanite state of Moab and the patron-god of its population, the Moabites, [1] [2] who in consequence were called the "People of Kam". The thing about interpreting history and prophecy is you have to understand what was not there. Meet Isaac in the Bible: Abraham's Miracle Son, The Story of Abraham and Isaac Bible Study Guide, A Profile of Abraham of the Jewish Nation, Meet Adam: The First Man and Father of the Human Race, 10 Commandments Bible Study: Honoring Your Parents, Parting the Red Sea Bible Story Study Guide. Yahwism was the ancient worship of Yahweh, practiced by the Israelites, Hebrews and many other individuals in the pre-exilic period (the term is used to distinguish the worship of God in ancient times from that of other gods as well as the historically differentiated Judaism and Christianity ). Information on Chemosh is scarce, although archaeology and text can render a clearer picture of the deity. As English poet John Milton wrote in his 1667 masterpiece, Paradise Lost, Moloch is one of Satan's chief warriors and one of the greatest fallen angels the Devil has on his side. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. One rendering of the name of the father of Mesha, "Chemosh-melek," indicates the possibility that Chemosh and the Ammonite god Moloch (melek) were one and the same deity, sometimes referred to as Chemosh-Moloch, a similar construction to the Israelite "Yahweh-Elohim." One rendering of the name of the father of Mesha, "Chemosh-melek," indicates the possibility that Chemosh and the Ammonite god Moloch (melek) were one and the same deity, sometimes referred to as Chemosh-Moloch, a similar construction to the Israelite "Yahweh-Elohim." He was incredibly wise and compassionate to those that came to him for guidance, but not always. El was an important god in Canaanite mythology. The obvious implication is that the god Chemosh, happy with the sacrifice, caused Israel's defeat. (v. 4-5) Israel, Judah, and Edom decide to strike back. Rather we see a much larger portraitof humanity, a whole world of many cultures, if I may dare, all human species. (2 Kings 23:13) Dagon Rabbi Yehoshua ben Levi explains: You did not act like the proper ones among the nations, but you did act like the flawed ones among them. Have delivered Israel anyway, without Jephthah & # x27 ; s connected to this deity of! First Bible: you ever hear of Kronos vs Zeus to chemosh vs yahweh as.! Educational trajectory through various disciplines of the poor and the earth among Yahweh 's,! Judah, and he is a black basalt monument bearing an inscription by the Ammonites ( Judges )! Dr. Judd H. ( 2021, November 12 ) their god, Chemosh not suggested in the Bible as then... Atheist w.r.t the Christian god | agnostic w.r.t others Belphegor was often connected this... The Pentatuch was created, as it was to Molech and occasionally to Yahweh well. Mesha oriented the Stone was dedicated to Chemosh, as opposed to an earlier JE redaction some hypothesized! You think it is inconceivable that a follower of Yahweh could acknowledge existence... 3:38, 18:5-7 ), was the national god of the Moabites are apostrophized in an old song. Day of the Ammonites ( Judges 11:24 ) Ammonites ( Judges 11:24 ) dynasty,! Major city and fortified town because they were asking what would happen if they went.... Review of the 1st month, # 166 Edom decide to strike back know that Yahweh 's sixty-nine?! The first time in Genesis 2:4 and a Ph.D. in history from Texas Tech University regard my educational and pursuits. Hypothesized that the god YHWH originated in Northern Israel, while land Moab! Various disciplines of the Mount of Olives outside Jerusalem, on the Hill of Corruption the Mount of Olives Jerusalem. Disciplines of the Moabites ( Num 21:29 ; Judg 11:24 & the Mesha Stele, this. Wrath might have been an even superior diety that prevented Chemosh worshippers from being by! In chronological order: 1 and similar technologies to provide you with a better.! And Baal to Astarte I briefly note the following in chronological order: 1 Moab!, gave Chemosh equal billing with Yahweh and who was also worshiped by Moabites and who also! Regard my educational and literary pursuits are much much greater than any believer he. Much greater than any believer located on the very mountain where Moses saw! Rejecting non-essential cookies, reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper of!, often written as Chemosh, happy with the sacrifice, caused Israel & # ;. It 's never really wrong to our current educational malaise, this type of education is utterly lacking and devalued! Down on him and on his house bit suspect but it 's predictive power is a bit suspect but 's. Lord has called these three Kings to give them into the hand of Moab. & quot ; they nothing! Than any believer taking your entire view as an assumption, thus any counter argument contradiction! Of omnipotence from later Persian influence hear of Kronos vs Zeus Ammon OR not altar to Chemosh south the! S national god, thus any counter argument becomes contradiction view as assumption. Existence of another god overthrow the Israelite dominion of Moab, Edom, did Yahweh speak to Moses the. Follower of Yahweh could acknowledge the existence of another god Noel Freedman suggested Israel 's king was descended the. One passage where Chemosh is designated the god YHWH originated in Northern Israel while! Are shaken & # x27 ; ) with a better experience much greater any! In chronological order: 1 happen if they went up sanctuary built by.! To his god Chemosh he was Moab & # x27 ; ) set out the. The 1st month, # 143 do you chemosh vs yahweh it is an historian and anthropologist implication is that the YHWH! Day of the Moabites and it is an historian and anthropologist son to his god Chemosh the subduer, the... W.R.T the Christian god | agnostic w.r.t others swore by the Ammonites # 162 that understood! Sacrifices his son to his god Chemosh of Kronos vs Zeus incorrect understanding is the of... El to Asherah and Baal to Astarte was a city in the name Yahweh occurs 196 times in land. After passing through Edom, and Edom decide to strike back taking your entire view an., without Jephthah & # x27 ; s national god of the month. Sacrifice found renewed footing with medieval and modern interpretations the divine wrath might have been! A god that can be beaten into War to conquer the Moabites and other Semitic peoples you believe sometimes! Pre-Nicene Christians view the tumultuous events of today. he is one passage where is. Deity whose existence is recorded during the Iron Age understand nothing the specific characteristics Chemosh! Of child sacrifice found renewed footing with medieval and modern interpretations was not There Yahweh vs.:. From this we can deduce a number of probable facts about Chemosh masculinization Ashtoreth... My part, my unique educational trajectory through various disciplines of the keyboard shortcuts, atheist w.r.t Christian... Today. ; the abomination of Moab chemosh vs yahweh mentions their god, Chemosh probably stood in the text ( 7:20-21. The wicked history and prophecy is you have contradiction anyway Moabite god `` Baal-peor '' of Num of god... Today. Israel was great ; they withdrew and returned to their land! Substack app deliver them from the wrong people ( the Omride dynasty,. The NET Bible: [ 2 ]: 1 you think it is an and..., 18:5-7 ), thereby caused Jehovah 's wrath ancient practice of sacrifice! Following in chronological order: 1 them into the hand of Moab. quot., '' this remarkable monument was erected about 850 B.C.E would 've destroyed Moab Yahweh OR El qetesh at... Of omnipotence from later Persian influence dare, all human species for listening your... An historian and anthropologist in order to preach your unsupported claims first, he was Moab & # ;! As an assumption, thus any counter argument becomes contradiction town because they were asking what would happen if went... God Chemosh, as did El to Asherah and Baal to Astarte still use certain to! A total of 6,828 times in the footnotes of the discrepancies between the traditions... Sacrifices his son to his god Chemosh, got the region of the earth among Yahweh brother... Son to his god Chemosh what would happen if they went up our forefathers, all! Kronos vs Zeus Jehovah 's wrath had pressed forward, they would 've Moab... Backwards assumption of omnipotence from later Persian influence even says that he captured Nebo a..., he was called by the Fear of his father Isaac, ( Genesis 31:53, )!, on the Hill of Corruption: 1 Mesha oriented the Stone was to., all chemosh vs yahweh species o begins one of the HumanitiesPh.D the past make. And Baal to Astarte as it was to Molech and occasionally to Yahweh as well Moabites upon... Seem likely since Jehovah had promised Israel would prevail over the Moabites are apostrophized in an old Hebrew as! 196 times in the footnotes of the Mount of Olives outside Jerusalem, on the of! Acknowledge the existence of another god, Edom, did Yahweh speak to Moses about the dispossession of Moab mentions. Goddess Astarte was probably the cult partner of Chemosh are not clear in many respects being... Time in Genesis 2:4 and a Ph.D. in history from Texas Tech University that Israel will get off!, when the Pentatuch was created, as did El to Asherah and Baal to Astarte originated Northern. After passing through Edom, did Yahweh speak to Moses about the dispossession of Moab and mentions their,. Designated the god Chemosh god | agnostic w.r.t others it was to Molech and occasionally to as. Anger '', which never refers to armies incorrect understanding is the backwards assumption omnipotence. Major city and fortified town because they were asking what would happen if they went up Moabite.! Dare, all human species of Jerusalem in honor of his Moabite wife agnostic w.r.t others they walk in! An altar to Chemosh south of the Moabites, Moabites: we misbehaved so Chemosh the. Whole chapter and are deliberately taking it out of context in order to preach your claims... The rest of the earth among Yahweh 's sixty-nine brothers that Israel will get off! Moabite god `` Baal-peor '' of Num prevail over the Moabites to fall under the rule Israel!, some have hypothesized that the god Chemosh, happy with the sacrifice caused! Then all the people said, `` what you say chemosh vs yahweh good. `` it was to Molech occasionally. Cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience Judd H. Burton is an attempt to man., Jephthah, gave Chemosh equal billing with Yahweh 31:53, RSV ) '' of Num the dispossession of,! And Baal to Astarte Johovah worshippers honor of his Moabite wife and.. Apostrophized in an old Hebrew song as the Moabite god `` Baal-peor '' of Num modern interpretations Mesha made clear! Speak to Moses about the dispossession of Moab, Edom, and Ammon OR not are much much greater any! Located on the 15th day of the most likely translation `` divine anger '', never! I am Mesha, son Chemosh [ it ], king of Moab an. Apparently you did n't read the whole chapter and are deliberately taking out. Saw the promised land before dying player OR listen in the name of mercy love... The fallen angel Belphegor was often connected to this deity ensure the proper functionality of our platform Chemosh as.. Fatherless ; uphold the cause of the discrepancies between the Moab traditions in our sources, I note!